MGMA Podcasts

Daniel Williams: 00:02

Well, hi, everyone. I'm Daniel Williams, senior editor at MGMA and host of the MGMA Podcast Network. We have another MGMA member spotlight podcast today, and I'm so excited to bring on our guest. It's Melanie Stohl. Melanie reached out to us.

Daniel Williams: 00:21

She is a MGMA Podcasts listener and heard about the member spotlight program that we do, and so reached out and said, Hey, I'd love to be on the show. So I'm going to throw that out to everybody listening. If you are listening and you want to be on the show, please let me know. So with that said, Melanie is director of pediatrics for the pediatric service line at mHealth Fairview, and is current chair of the Minnesota MGMA Board. Melanie Stohl, welcome to the show.

Melanie Stohl: 00:56

Hi. Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure.

Daniel Williams: 00:59

Yeah. It's so good to get to catch up with you. We received your email, I don't know, a month or so ago and was so excited to get it. You were just so kind and all your thoughts and the things that you said there about the show and about wanting to be a part of it. So you and I were catching up offline.

Daniel Williams: 01:22

A few things I just want to share, you'd said that I'm in the Denver area and you have, I believe it's a daughter who's just joined us here in Denver. So tell us about that.

Melanie Stohl: 01:34

Yeah. So she is graduating as well. She's got her business degree. She's currently going to North Dakota State University and had an opportunity to move out to the Denver area for a career, and her boyfriend lives out there too with his family, so got to move her out there the March, April. So really excited to be able to connect myself with Denver even more through her and everything that I get to do through the MGMA being part of the Minnesota chapter.

Melanie Stohl: 02:10

So really excited to now have an extra excuse to go to to Denver and spend even more time out there as well.

Daniel Williams: 02:18

Okay. If you can sneak away for an hour or two, you can come tour the beautiful MGMA studios and our building Yeah. As

Melanie Stohl: 02:29

I'd love that.

Daniel Williams: 02:30

Great. Now one more thing. You were telling us offline as well that you're graduating. So tell us about your program and what all that meant and that kind of career learning mentality that you have.

Melanie Stohl: 02:45

Yeah. You know, I started actually education journey quite later in life than probably most traditional healthcare leaders. I didn't get my bachelor's until I was in my mid to late 30s and actually got that at the University of Colorado. Okay. They were doing an online program way back in the day that was pretty revolutionary.

Melanie Stohl: 03:10

You know, being a mom of two kids and traveling, sports, and you know, a wife and all the things, just online education wasn't widely available back then like it is today. Right. And so got connected with that program and did my bachelor's in about three years, did the online program. I was the mom with the laptop at basketball and soccer writing papers, but really gave me a valuable insight of education, learning while working, and being able to apply those two things so simultaneously, it was really great. I was able to apply a lot of like my projects into real world experiences and real life experiences, and it really took a lot away from that.

Melanie Stohl: 03:57

Moving forward, wanted to continue in my education learning, so I, right now, am going to the University of St. Thomas. I'm doing their healthcare MBA program, and have been doing that the last two years. Friday, this coming Friday, I'm actually presenting my capstone, and hopefully if all goes well, we'll be graduating as of Friday. So really excited, and again, a great opportunity to even take my education even further, more from a executive level learning and really understanding the whole picture.

Melanie Stohl: 04:34

And again, was able to utilize projects we were working on within our organization and putting those into my school program as well, and just really being able to connect the dots when we're talking about things. And I remember in one of our finance classes, we were going through a budget, and it just like all the dots started connecting because, I mean, I've known budgets, you know, as much as I needed to for what I did from a place of business. But being able to put it fully together and connect the why and how and how each piece plays such an integral role in the overall execution of, you know, really healthcare and how where the money comes from for our projects and people and all the things. It was just a really great opportunity and really excited to continue not only my learning and education, but bringing what I've learned to my teams. That's also been a huge highlight.

Melanie Stohl: 05:28

Usually after my on campus sessions, on Monday, they're like, what'd you learn in class? What can you share with us? It's been so fun to take what I'm learning and bringing that back to my team and sharing it with them. And now I have a couple of managers that have said, Hey, I think I might want to try this program too. So it's been really great to be able to share my journey, and really encourage them to pursue their own learning journey as well.

Daniel Williams: 05:51

That is so awesome. Well, congratulations. That is so exciting. And my daughter is graduating on next Friday as well. It may come out after that, but we're really excited.

Daniel Williams: 06:05

She's graduating from college, and so we're super excited about that.

Melanie Stohl: 06:10

It's hard to have your kids grow up, but it's so exciting to watch them just go out into the world and, you know, talk about things and be able to share those experiences and journeys.

Daniel Williams: 06:20

Yeah. It really is. So let's get to the career side of it. Now as I mentioned earlier, you're at mHealth Fairview. That's in Minnesota.

Daniel Williams: 06:30

Tell us about the practice, size, and scope of it. Anything else you might wanna share with us so we get a better idea of what you all do there?

Melanie Stohl: 06:39

Sure. Sure. So I actually work out of University of Minnesota Physicians. So we are partnered with Fairview Health, which is where the mHealth Fairview comes from. So currently right now I'm the director of our pediatric specialties.

Melanie Stohl: 06:53

So we have around 27 specialties that we support around nine clinic entities. Some of our clinics are HBC hospital based clinics, and some of our clinics are freestanding clinics. So I actually started my healthcare journey when I was in high school. So my first job ever was a payment poster. And really where I got to learn my love for healthcare was on the back end, learning about insurances and payments and prior authorizations and really diving deep into the revenue cycle piece, and really understood the barriers that can come with, you know, all of those pieces needing to align for someone to receive medical care.

Melanie Stohl: 07:37

And really became passionate about that. That led me to become a certified coder, which, you know, brought me into a different realm of healthcare as well, and from there just really grew. I worked my way up into supervisor positions, manager positions, director positions, executive leader positions, and I really think one of the areas where I hold a little bit of a different value is I have I have worked every position. I've done the front desk job. I've done the prior auth.

Melanie Stohl: 08:08

I've done the credentialing. You know, I've done the insurance piece. I've roomed patients. You know, all of those things. And I think it really gives you a good sense of understanding upstream and downstream the impact that changes have in an organization.

Melanie Stohl: 08:23

What some people think is just a small change at check-in or a small change in the rooming process or a small change of physician documentation sometimes doesn't understand all the pieces that need to happen before that patient gets there and after. And I think that's a value that I've really been able bring in my leadership experience of being at the table to say, Let's pause for a moment. Let's talk about all the different steps that need to happen before we get there, and all the steps that have to happen after. And usually it's like, Oh, didn't think of that. And so I really value the fact that I have been able to work in all of those different areas and bring that forth even with my team.

Melanie Stohl: 09:06

You know, I think one of the greatest things to do with your team is to learn alongside them when you're talking about a project or bringing something new to say, Walk me through this. What don't I know? What do I need to know? And what are the barriers in us getting that done? And so I think being able to bring that to the table is, so valuable and something that's really helped me as I've built my career in leadership.

Daniel Williams: 09:31

Yeah. You have a lot on your plate. You're doing so much at the practice. It's an MBA, right, with a kind of health emphasis, right? In addition to that, you are chair of the Minnesota MGMA.

Daniel Williams: 09:51

Yes,

Melanie Stohl: 09:51

makes me busy.

Daniel Williams: 09:52

Holy moly. Talk about that relationship. How did that get started? Were you first involved with the state affiliate, the Minnesota MGMA, or the national MGMA? And who introduced you to the other one, and how'd you learn about the other?

Melanie Stohl: 10:09

Yeah. I actually have been a national member for a very long And kind of got into being a national member when I got into coding because I used that as an area to talk with other coders, you know, when I had questions or reaching out about things. And then from there, I started attending the, you know, some webinars and doing the yearly education courses. There used to be a training they used to do in Florida that was really popular that I would go to, and really got connected with the people. It was such an incredible community, especially as a new leader and, you know, someone that was looking for that community to be able to say, hey, what do I need to know?

Melanie Stohl: 10:54

Where am I not doing this right? I'm trying to figure this out. Where do I go? Not only from a community like in Minnesota, but just nationally, right? I think that there's such value.

Melanie Stohl: 11:07

And so I got connected more nationally, really involved there. And then I got connected on the Minnesota chapter about two years ago. So Minnesota is a new chapter within the MGMA, And I say we're a small but but mighty group. We right now have about 36 members.

Daniel Williams: 11:25

Oh, it's awesome.

Melanie Stohl: 11:26

Yeah. We're getting there. We're Well,

Daniel Williams: 11:29

I know you're gonna get 35 listeners then. Right? You're other You're gonna

Melanie Stohl: 11:33

you know, our my goal is to try to get to a 100 by the end of the year. So I we've got a lofty goal, and I think I think we can do it. That's right. But I one thing I I wish people knew was just the sense of like, the community boards. I use the community boards daily, and they are such a great way to connect with people who are doing the work and to learn, like, who's doing it really well, who, you know, who's failed and who's gonna share, like, you know, share those failures so we don't make the same mistakes.

Melanie Stohl: 12:06

And it's so great because people are so kind and gracious with their time and energy and what they're willing to share. You know, so I think from a state level, one of the things we're really trying to build is our in person engagement. So we're trying to set up some in person meet and greets. I think, you know, we're trying to maybe do something on a larger level next year for a retreat and a learning opportunity. One thing we've started doing, we started this January, is we do power hours, the first Wednesday of every month, and we take a different topic, and it's just like a coffee connection.

Melanie Stohl: 12:45

You show up with your cup of coffee or tea or whatever your drink of choice is, and we just have conversation. Have gotten to meet some incredible leaders across Minnesota that are just doing some remarkable things, and usually there's no agenda there's usually a topic, and we kind of ask some questions to get things started, but it's usually just great conversation, and, you know, we get to share so much of even from like a patient centered approach, like how are we supporting patients? What are you doing? You know, again, like the what works, what doesn't work, and I have just found such value in that, and it connects people and even connections offline of, you know, hey, I have a great topic for next month. Can we talk about this?

Melanie Stohl: 13:30

Or I've had people reach out to say, I'm really struggling with this in my organization. Can we talk about it? And I love the vulnerability and the humility of that because we all don't have the answers and we all have a lot of things that we need to, you know, fix, and it takes a village, right? And it's just such an incredible space to really let your guard down, I think, and be vulnerable and ask those tough questions. And so I have really appreciated my time being able to lead that organization and really have some great goals.

Melanie Stohl: 14:07

We have a small board team as well, and we're always looking for board members, so a plug if anybody in Minnesota wants to be part of our board. We're definitely taking on some new members, but really have a lot of great opportunities. Unfortunately, I need the people to be able to do a lot of those, but I'm very confident that we're gonna be able to move it forward really quickly.

Daniel Williams: 14:28

That is so cool. So you reached out to us, and you shared some of the things you had going on. One of those was leading teams through significant times of change. Talk about that. What exactly was going on?

Daniel Williams: 14:44

Was it with the organization itself? Was it health care? And how did you address that and help knit together the different teams, departments, and maintain a strong culture?

Melanie Stohl: 14:56

Yeah. I think there's two things that are pretty significant in that happening in Minnesota right now. So first from an organizational perspective. So University of Minnesota Physicians and Fairview are kind of creating a unique partnership. It's unfortunate, you know, there's been a lot of things in the news, you know, with with the different entities.

Melanie Stohl: 15:17

And with part of that change, many of us at our University of Minnesota physician employees are gonna be transitioning to Fairview as an employment home. Now it doesn't change how we do our work. It doesn't change the mission or the why we do our work. You know, we're all coming together for the same thing, but, you know, the name on our paycheck might be different. Our team, you know, that's kind of the only thing changing.

Melanie Stohl: 15:44

But that's really hard for people, right? There's a lot of people that have a strong connection to the organization that they work in. And we have a lot of employees that have been with, you know, University of Minnesota Physicians for ten, fifteen, twenty plus years, and that carries a of, you know, that carries a lot on someone's heart and, you know, that's their identity, is their work. And so we've had to go through a lot of that change the last, you know, couple months with the transition being this summer. You know?

Melanie Stohl: 16:17

It's a lot of conversations. I think it's being honest and transparent and vulnerable. Oftentimes it's me as a leader showing up saying, I don't have any more answers than you have right now. We're all getting the same information, but I'm here to listen. Right?

Melanie Stohl: 16:35

I probably can't tell you anything new that you don't already know. And I think that's hard because I think there's an assumption that, like, I know all the answers and I know what's gonna happen and and really I don't. But I think in those moments, you need to lean in and just be okay with not knowing what comes next. You need to be okay with not having the answer, and you need to be okay with just listening and being able to say like, thank you for sharing. I I don't have an answer, but I'm going to do my best to get you the answer you need to make the decision that's best for you.

Melanie Stohl: 17:11

Sometimes it's just saying, yeah. You know what? This sucks, And and I I get that. This is really hard. This is gonna be a change for a lot of us.

Melanie Stohl: 17:20

We're very dedicated to our work, but I think, you know, coming back and just tying in the mission and the why we show up every day, I think, is so important. And that's one thing I keep sharing is that, like, the work we're doing is not changing. The people we're supporting in our communities we're wrapping our arms around are not changing. Our physician partners are not changing. Our teams are not changing.

Melanie Stohl: 17:44

You know, how we show up every day is not changing. Those are the things that matter most, right? And those are the things that should give us our identity and our why and how we show up every day and all of those things. And so I will say I'm so blessed to have such an amazing team, we've all rallied around each other. And I think another area of that too that Minnesota faced was recently in like February and March when we had the ICE incidents.

Melanie Stohl: 18:12

You know, that really impacted so many of our patients and their families, and it impacted our coworkers and our and our teams and people that we sat next to every day. And that was really hard. And it's hard to show up and be authentic in a moment of chaos and uncertainty. And I will say again, that was another moment where, you know, I think we all had to just dig in and and understand what our why was. Why do we show up every day?

Melanie Stohl: 18:45

Why are we in healthcare? Why do we do this work? And, you know, again, we just didn't have all the answers. We couldn't explain why it was happening. We couldn't explain, you know, when somebody was going to be coming back, you know, to work or when a family member was going to come back.

Melanie Stohl: 19:01

But I think in those moments as a community, we really rallied and just supported one another, and it was a really beautiful thing. And I think it's just a true testament that, you know, when people show up and they show up for the right reasons, it doesn't matter what side you're on, you show up for each other, and you show up for your community, and you show up for your team. And I think we did that so graciously and just so remarkably. And I think that is that is something I'm so proud of my teams, and just even our organization, really how they did that and and gave space for people to just not be okay. And I think that was just so important.

Daniel Williams: 19:41

Was that did y'all have an action plan that was put in place? Did you do formal meetings to meet with people, or was it informal by department? Share with us because other organizations, leaders listening right now, they may have different types of, I'll call it, disaster recovery plans. Like if mother nature came into play and there were things that happened, you have plans for that. First, what happened in your area?

Daniel Williams: 20:12

What was the plan that was put in place and what did you convey with your teams?

Melanie Stohl: 20:17

Yeah. You know, I think there various plans for different things, right? So for like our emergency rooms, our hospital systems, you know, visitors, all of those things. One of the things that I think from a clinic and what we did from a pediatric perspective was a couple of different things. So one, we set up daily huddles, both in the morning and at the end of the day, really as a space for our leaders to come with questions like, what are you hearing?

Melanie Stohl: 20:47

What are you seeing? What are you feeling? What are the teams, you know, what what's going on with the teams? And from there, we would take that information and kinda gauge what actions needed to happen. Was it you know?

Melanie Stohl: 20:59

And from that, like, we were holding, you know, weekly town halls, weekly connections. We were putting out emails every day, but we were trying to do it from a space of not having email fatigue and not just putting something out to put something out. Obviously, in the beginning, it was a little more, you know, firefighting of, like, trying to just anticipate what was gonna happen next and trying to get in front of that. And then from there, we we also opened up and had, you know, what we called our weekly peds chats. And we would have a space for employees.

Melanie Stohl: 21:35

We would have a a, you know, anywhere from thirty minutes to an hour where you could just call in and ask questions and have an open forum. It it wasn't for us to cascade information, but just what do you need to hear from us? What do you need? You know, because each department was a little different on what their needs were. And so really, we tried to come from a space of how do we support the work that's currently happening, all while trying to anticipate next steps.

Melanie Stohl: 22:04

Right? And I will say, you know, there were some things we probably could have done a lot better. Think in retrospect, that's a great opportunity to look back and say, okay, if this happens again, what do we do better? How do we get in front of it? And and how do we create that change?

Melanie Stohl: 22:20

And really, part of that was, you know and we're still doing this going around and asking that question of our teams. Like, what did you feel we did really well? What could we have improved upon? What did you need more of us? What did you need more from us?

Melanie Stohl: 22:34

Or, you know, what did you get that gave you what you needed? And so that was really great feedback, and for the most part, everyone felt very supported. I think where they wanted additional information was the stuff that we just didn't have, right? It was stuff that was way beyond our organization, and it was stuff more from a state level or a government level, and again, I think just having that space of silence and listening, and it's okay to not have an answer. And even though people are looking at you for an answer, they want you to solve the problem, Just coming at this with, you know, we're just gonna create a space to be safe.

Melanie Stohl: 23:18

You know? And I think, you know, we're really focusing on, like, you know, psychological safety and creating those safe spaces of, you know, if something's happening, speak up. Let's let's talk about it. Right? If you know, for us, the biggest thing was, you know, the biggest question was, well, what do we do if an ICE agent shows up?

Melanie Stohl: 23:37

What do we do if they're if they're coming into our clinic? What if they're standing outside? And and a lot of it was what ifs, which is it's hard to anticipate for that what if. Right? But you have to be prepared for it.

Melanie Stohl: 23:49

And I think that's what was so hard is you're trying to cascade all this information of here's what you do. The reality is if that person shows up at the door, all that information is gonna go right out of your brain, right? And so it's just, it's acknowledging just be yourself and be human and do what you think, you know, is best. As much as you can train for it and put the information out, I think it was just really allowing people to be human. Right?

Melanie Stohl: 24:17

And we're gonna make mistakes, and we did make some mistakes, and that was okay. We learned from them. It you know? And it just makes us better for the next time. Hopefully, there's not a next time.

Melanie Stohl: 24:26

I'm gonna say I don't wanna have to

Daniel Williams: 24:28

Of course.

Melanie Stohl: 24:28

Answer that just like, you know, I think we can all say we hope you know, there's never a COVID incident, but I think, you know, from those episodes, you learn and you grow and you you figure out what you need to do best, and and they help and grow us as people and leaders and organizations.

Daniel Williams: 24:43

Right. Final question, and I want to follow-up on that. So you've got a lot of different specialties. Do you have different locations, and were any of the locations impacted in a way where people were rerouted or patients were maybe reluctant to go to see their physicians just because of potential dangers out there?

Melanie Stohl: 25:08

Yeah. You know, I think one thing that was really hard is so, you know, one of our main hospital campuses and where a majority of our specialties are in one of our hospital based clinics was right in the area where a lot of the unrest was happening. And so we had a lot of patients that did not feel safe coming to that area, coming to that location, which we respected. And so I think as a group, we managed that very well on trying to either reschedule to a different location, doing virtual visits, you know, trying to put patient safety at the forefront of everything we did. And and we're still feeling some of that, right?

Melanie Stohl: 25:51

There's still patients that don't feel comfortable coming down to certain locations or being in certain locations, and I think that's part of healthcare, and I think part of that change we're constantly feeling of, you know, sometimes you have to go outside the traditional model, right? And how do you create the workflows and processes and set it up? Sometimes it's like you've got an hour to figure something out, and you just have to do what's best. And I think those are some of those learning moments too of, you know, you have to learn to think quickly. You have to learn that, you know, I think in healthcare, there's lots of policies, but there's, you know, there has to be some gray too because they're people, and they're individuals who are trying to seek healthcare and we're in a space of we're trying to provide that for them.

Melanie Stohl: 26:44

And so how do you think innovatively and how do you think outside the box in those moments to be able to do that? And sometimes they work and sometimes they don't. But that is still definitely something that we are we're working through is building back up that safety, and it's even communicating now. Here's what we do to keep you safe. Here's what we do to make sure that, you know, if you want an escort to and from your car, if you need a ride, you know, working with our social workers and trying to get that set up.

Melanie Stohl: 27:14

If it's if we need to, you know, do all of your visits virtually right now, let's figure out how to do that. If we need to transfer your care to an outside clinic that is easier for you to get to. So I think it's just about putting people first and really just meeting them in a space that they feel comfortable, and sometimes you have to just be okay with that.

Daniel Williams: 27:39

Yeah. Melanie Stohl, what a wonderful opportunity to get to talk to you and hear your story. Thank you so much for sharing it with us.

Melanie Stohl: 27:48

Yeah. I appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Daniel Williams: 27:50

Yeah. Well, listening, I want to extend the offer again. Melanie reached out to us, and I am so glad she did. If you want to be on the MGMA Podcasts, please reach out to us, let us know, and I'd love to have you on here as a guest. So until then, thank you so much for being MGMA Podcast listeners.